the dark side of

Rouenwud

Working on the development of my SCA Name

and

Device

Jocelyne of Rowanwood  (1st pick)

Joscelyne of Rowanwood (suggested name)

Problem with the registration of rowanwood.  Found some documentation so it may pass.  I have to get it all together and printed out for submission

October Crown 10/14/07

I consulted the Herald's early Sunday Morning.  Turns out it's Owen, whom I had contact with via e-mail, and another lady (didn't get her name)

I misread Owen's email and I have to pick a spelling from the following:

Joscelin      1199

Jocelyn

Joscelin  page 177 of Withycome's Book

It's a Norman Name introduced into England.

Rowanwood will be presented from the 1997 request of another rowanwood.

Then the device, this took forever (an hour at least)  You have to be 2 changes away from a registered device and apparently what I've picked was not.  The woman then assisted me while Owen helped another lady who'd been waiting all this time.

This women was very very helpful and came up with the idea of the par fess with two trees Counterchanged.  At the time, I was having trouble visualizing it, but Wow, I like very much.  Simple and tasteful!

My daughter likes the green....and I love the color but the blue is classy too I'm really really pulled.

12_16_07

Finally got the 4 color copies done (colored by hand) and one BW copy to submit to the heralds.

I asked my husband which color blue or green reminds him of me.

ANS:  GREEN

(He thinks of Orange & Brown otherwise)

so, I'm getting all the paperwork & check ready to submit.  Then it takes about 6 months for it to go through.

Also, I've been told not to design or embroider anything with the device until it's approved.  But I can sill use green :-D

12_19_07

Well it's off to NV to the submission Herald.  I hope I got all the copies they need and I sent my check $10.00 according to the web site today.  So the cost is less as well.  I now have a long wait and of course I don't know if the documentation I sent in is in the correct format.  It just doesn't say anywhere what it should look like.

If I have to I'll use Jocelyn of Rouen's Wood, if that would work and if not the shorter Jocelyn of Rouen.  Either way the Rouen and Rowan sound so close and if the device passes, the it would make a great Medieval Pun (which is very period :-D )

1_06_07

It's the day after 12th Night!  I did get to speak with the chief Herald at Court.  They were dealing with the Court and Coronation but he took the time to speak with me which was so VERY NICE of him.  (must find out his name)(5_30_08 found out it was Duke Frederick of Holland "Fleig", who has been King and just about everything else, since he started with the SCA since day one.  He invented the BC Sunshade.  BC stands for Klingon Battle Cruiser)  Ya gota admit, the SCA does have a sense of humor.

They have received my request (Yeah!)

No News is Good News...he said and it will take up to 6 months for the whole thing to go through.

I told him I was flexi on the Rowanwood thing, so I'll probably be officially Joscelyn of Rouen, but I'll go by Jocelyn of Rowanwood to my friends.

2_08_08

No News yet, that's good, so far...1 month down.

3_21_08

OK, my name is in the OSCAR web page of the heraldry for review.  Jocelyn of Rowanwood!  No device is listed however and nothing from them.  I'll ask the herald at March Crown.

On another note, I purchased some seeds and on 11_20_07 they were put, after a 24 hour soaking, into the refrigerator with a damp paper towel.  I took a look at them on occasion and nothing.  However after 16 weeks (March) I was supposed to plant the seeds.  Oops, forgot.  Checked them on 3_19_08 and they had started to sprout and the mould had started to grow on them.  Put them in a pot of soil and placed it outside.  I will need luck to have them grow.  I hope to get a few trees out of this jumble of seeds (200).  Of course they are Rowan (Sorbus aucuparia).

I checked in at the Herald Pavilion at March Crown.  The lady there said that she was behind in the rejection letters.  I'll need two changes if there is a conflict.

3_22_08

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6.Jocelyn of Rowanwood - New Name

Submitter has no desire as to gender.
Authenticity NOT requested.
Sound most important.

Jocelyn is listed as the header spelling in Withycombe p. 177. Dated spellings include Jocelin to 1196 and Joscelin to 1199. The interchange between Y and I is well documented in period English.

of Rowanwood: Reaney & Wilson (p. 385 s.n. Rowntree) dates the byname Rountre to 1301. Ekwall (p. 15 s.n. Ashwood) dates the spellings Aswude to 1232 and Asshewode to 1292. Given these examples, a constructed location of Rowanwood would seem plausible. The likely period forms it would take would be Rounwode (earlier) or Rowanwode or Rowanwood (later).

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This is the entry placed on-line for the January 08 Letter of Intent.  With no device shown.  Still no information from the heralds on my device or anything for that matter

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Well while checking out the Herald Web pages, I saw in the meeting notes of January that my device was rejected because it was not on one form.  I shot off an email to my local & consulting herald and he answered me right away!

So I have to re-submit the device.  I'll have to hand color them all over again.  I can understand the reasoning and the problems that they have had with printer inks fading and then they don't have a good copy of the device.  Somehow I failed to print out the word document & documentation of the device:

Per Fess Vert and Argent Two Trees (Sorbus Aucuparia) eradicated in pale counter changed

Hope this all works.  Once again, I have to color between the lines.  Also they didn't like the roots "they look like fringe"  So I've changed the images.   I can't believe that I didn't keep at least one copy for myself last time.  I've got this well documented on my computer now.

4_04_08

I should hear something about my name by June.  The Device should be sometime in October....a long wait.

4_13_08

Of course, I've still not heard anything at all from the SCA.

Being pro active as I am, I've been checking the Herald Web Site weekly to see if they have updated the meeting notes (no, still show March) and the LOIAR (stands for letters of Intent and return) Well on Friday checking and there is an April 30th link and Yay!!! my device is submitted.  I was afraid that since I'd typed Par instead of Per they would reject the form (again) but they didn't.  I'm item #12:

12: Jocelyn of Rowanwood - New Device

Per fess vert and argent in pale two trees eradicated counterchanged.

Submitter's name was included on the January 2008 LoI.

It's now another waiting game.  I don't have the foggest idea when the name will be accepted and I'm sure it will be another 6 months to find out about the device.  However, once accepted, no one else in the SCA world can have my name or device.

5_4_08

Looks like there will not be another Herald meeting till July.  I'll have to wait till then to hear about the name part.  Unknown how long the wait for the device.  I think I'll try to come up with a badge.  I'm thinking a dog on the design on green & white.  I noticed that I've been avoiding greens in my garb.  I'm making everything blue...oh well.  Maybe it will bring good Karma. (btw, I still have never heard about my device rejection in January.  I thank the internet gods they have minutes posted otherwise, I'd still be thinking everything was OK and it would take another year!

A small rant:  I understand that the whole herald review thing is voluntary, however, there is money exchanged so they do have an obligation to me.  If no money exchanged hands, and if I never got word back, then bad on them, but I'd have no reason to complain..you get what you pay for...so since I did send in money, I feel justified in placing my rant here.  I've not complained to anyone one else, just here about this whole process.

5_30_08

Yea! They posted up the April Meeting Notes:  My device is listed for submission.

Jocelyn of Rowanwood     (Southern Shores)     Resubmission of New Device to Kingdom.

Per fess vert and argent in pale two trees eradicated counterchanged.

Submitter has redrawn the trees to have longer roots and has submitted the drawings on the proper forms.

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So now both are submitted and it will take who knows how long for the review process. I'll have to submit my membership dues in August, since I won't know anything and I really want my name & device registered.

6_05_08

I keep checking the Herald Pages but I don't see anything so far about the name passing.

6_11_08

8_2_08

Checking on the status, the device has been moved from "In Commentary" to "Being Decided" it's next to my name, so it got put on the fast track some how since it was submitted several months later.

So, nothing has passed yet.  I've not seen anything on the rejection letters from the Laurel, thoses usually get posted.

I've renewed my membership today...it's been a year I've been with the SCA as a paying member.

http://oscar.sca.org/index.php?action=181

...Being Decided...

Jibra'il 'A{t.}{t.}ār - Calontir: Blanket Permission to Conflict
Jibra'il 'A{t.}{t.}ār - Calontir: Blanket Permission to Conflict - (Fieldless) A shepherd's crook bendwise sinister gules
Jocelyn della Spada - East: Name
Jocelyn della Spada - East: Device - Per fess indented argent and vert, two rapiers in saltire sable and a hedgehog argent.
Jocelyn of Rowanwood - West: Name
Jocelyn of Rowanwood - West: Device - Per fess vert and argent in pale two trees eradicated counterchanged.
Johan der Hund - Calontir: Name Change
Jóhann Steinarsson - Calontir: Name

9_06_08 Still no word...

It won't be offical until it reaches the Archive of Laurel Letters.

9_21_08 checked the Archive and they posted April...still nothing for me though.

10-1-08  Still no change. I see that Jocelyn della Spada has been accepted. Sigh...

10-15-08  Yay!!!! I have my name:  Jocelyn of Rowenwood

They changed the spelling:

Jocelyn of Rowenwood. Name.

Submitted as Jocelyn of Rowanwood, the byname was submitted as a constructed place name but no documentation was provided and none found to support the spelling Rowan-. We have changed the name to Jocelyn of Rowenwood, a constructed place name based on Rowenham 1269 in Watts, Cambridge Dictionary of English Place-Names, s.n. Rownhams, from OE ruh 'rough', and Byrdwood 1532 in Watts s.n. Birdwood. Smith, English Place Name Elements, s.v. ruh shows this word combined with various deuterothemes including leah, making a combination with a Middle English form of the deuterotheme wudu plausible.

I may just spell it:  Jocelyn of Rowenwud

I kinda like that better anyway....but offically I'm Rowenwood.

Now....the biggie....the device.  I sent an email to the Herald who helped me with the name to find out how much longer that will take.

OK, it's in the being decided phase (takes one month).  So it's been through the commentary phase.  I'm full of hope.  I want my device badly.

Keeping my fingers crossed

There was a possible conflict called on your device with the registered
"Per fess vert and argent, an elephant statant argent and a tree blasted
and eradicated proper."  At the kingdom meeting we supposed that a
_blasted_ tree proper (having no leaves) would be brown, so that there
would be CDs for the type of charge in chief (tree vs. elephant) and
tincture of charge in base (vert vs. brown), and therefore no conflict.  I
still think that ought to be the case, but we'll have to wait and see what
happens.  No other issues were raised.

This is the response from the Herald who has been helping me.  A device must have two distinct changes from any other and that is what he is describing above.

Even thought my device has been discussed, they won't get around to posting it for another 3 months!  Even then, there is no guarantee that it will pass.

10-15-08

Now it has been updated to say:

Pre-proofreading (then it goes to proofreading)  who knows how long that will be.

10_31_08

Checked the Herald site today and my device has moved to the Proofreading section. (1 Month)..That's SCA time, so still could be months away. I'm hopeful that it will pass though. Can't wait till I can put my colors and trees on my things.

11_18_08

So I've decided to change the spelling of my name to:

Jocelyn of Rouenwud

I'm not going to submit it for a while but will play with it when I sign in to events and such.  I've marked the bottom of my mug with the name.

11_23_08

Shot off an email to the email on 11/30/08 to the herald of the west kingdom.  Lets see if I get an answer.

12/2/08

I had hopped to get an answer by now...still nothing.

12_3_08

Still nothing.  Sent a copy of the email to another person and he will forward it on.

Good news today, my daughter got accepted to a 4 year!    12_9_08 

Today I checked the charts and the April LoI have been removed.  My device which was listed under proof-reading is now gone....however there are not LoI up for the month of August      

So this means that a decision has been made on the device...I just don't know what it is and won't know till they do...Sigh                                            12_13_08

I'm very frustrated, no answers from anyone.  August is not yet posted up and I'm pretty sure that's were my device is located, since it now says so on one of the sites and it is no where to be seen anywhere else.  So with 12th night less than 2 weeks away...nada for Jocelyn.                                                                                      12_23_08

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I've lost some of my notes so here is the best of what I can remember.

My device passed! They decided that there was no conflict with another device. I found out by checking the archives on Jan 5, 2009!

Here is the kicker, I got emails in Feb 2009 that my name and device had passed. The device had actually passed back in August 2008, but since the web site had not been updated till January...well

Total time frame: December 2007 - January 09!!!!!!! and the only notification Feb 09. never any answers to my questions except from the local herald who goes to all the events and answerers all my questions to the best of his ability. He was raised to a Pelican last year and he has earned it in my opinion.

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Glutton for punishment

I'm going for broke and I've deigned a badge. This will identify me & my household (should I ever have one) Met with Master Owen and he looked up what I wanted. We discussed what was available and if I get my documentation in this week, then I should have an approval by September 09 at the latest.

I'll keep track here, once again. 2/28/09 (last day in February)

This is not the submitted badge, but this is what I'm embroidering. I'm also getting a plate & Goblet made with a very special design. The dog will be a boxer based on my dog, Titus & will have a green & white collar..my colors. I'll pick them up at Beltane! yay..

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March 27, 2008

Nothing to report because there are no reports submited yet. Meeting was March 8th, so my paperwork should have made it to them.

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From the March West LoLI 2009

5: Jocelyn of Rowenwood - New Badge

OSCAR is unable to find the name, either registered or submitted.

(Fieldless) A talbot couchant contourney argent, charged on the shoulder with a fleur-de-lis vert

The submitter's name was registered in May, 2008, via the West (even though OSCAR cannot find it).

We noticed that the tail is shortened, but we did not consider it necessary to include this in the blazon.

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Now a 3 month wait.  End of June 2009.  I'm not as concerned this time around, it's a badge only and I'm going to use it regardless of approval or not.  A talbot is a hunting dog.  If I'd put dog that actually means = dog, fox or wolf

Boxers are decendents of those medieval hunting dogs, which is cool.

August 4, 2009

Sent out an email on the status of the badge:

Erm . . . no.  It's in _pre_-proofreading.  The submission was on our March LOI, which was ruled on at the July Laurel meetings, but as we have not yet seen the results from the May meetings published (and the sovereigns are currently at Pennsic), it may be a while before we get the official word. I'm not aware that there's even a draft version of the May letter yet.

An assertion was made that the details of the dog made it specifically a Jack Russell terrier, which is not a period breed.  Whether the Laurel office will agree with this remains to be seen.  There was also a quibble that the dog's rear end is not on the ground, questioning whether the blazon 'couchant' was appropriate.

No, it hasn't been rejected - yet.  Neither has it been accepted - yet. The decisions made at the meetings do not become official until published (and have, on relatively rare occasion, been known to change after the meeting.)  I'm afraid all we can do now is wait; I hope we'll see these results before the end of October, but there have been some non-SCA problems slowing things down a bit.  Sorry I don't have more news.

and

Me:  The dog is after my dog which is a boxer/hound mix.

Unless you're _exceedingly_ unlucky, the worst case that looks possible is that you may have to draw a different version _for submission_.  Nobody has come up with a conflict in the existing registrations, so unless someone slips in ahead of you (a remote possibility) redrawing should fix everything.  Once it gets registered you may draw your own dog - it's obviously a dog, which is the only thing we really ought to care about. And maybe it will pass this time.  We'll see.

So it may not pass even if it's in Pre-Proofreading.  Since I've changed what I'm doing anyway it doesn't matter...as he states above, it's a dog.

9_15_09 still in pre-proofreading, so change....nothing new about that.

10_08_09 In proofreading.

10_30_09  It's no longer listed Here.  So it's out of proofreading. Nothing in the minutes that I can find, so the badge is in Limbo.  How typical.

I have to wait till it shows up Here  or  Here the minutes.  Of course my badge is on the March Minutes and they are not listed yet (and it's October).

It's now November but the Loar (letters of Acceptance or Return) for March have been posted Here.

Jocelyn of Rowenwood. Badge. (Fieldless) A dog couchant contourny argent, charged on the shoulder with a fleur-de-lis vert.

This badge is clear of that of Kean de Lacy, (Fieldless) A fox couchant to sinister argent. There is a CD for fieldlessness and a CD for the addition of the fleur-de-lis.

Please instruct the submitter that the dog's hindquarters should be on the ground, not slightly raised.

My badge has passed........................................................I know this on 11_16_09

(I'm no herald, but both badges are fieldless, so that is not a CD..just sayn'  They changed Talbot to dog)

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6-27-10 Got this email today

Greetings!

Your badge was accepted on the July 2009 Letter of Acceptances and Returns and Laurel had this to say:
Jocelyn of Rowenwood. Badge. (Fieldless) A dog couchant contourny argent, charged on the shoulder with a fleur-de-lis vert.

This badge is clear of that of Kean de Lacy, (Fieldless) A fox couchant to sinister argent. There is a CD for fieldlessness and a CD for the addition of the fleur-de-lis

Please instruct the submitter that the dog's hindquarters should be on the ground, not slightly raised.

We apologize for the delay in notifying you of the results. Thank you for your patience.

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I say...well duh! Known that forever now....